Brisingr Spork, Part 16: To Answer a King

[pangolin20]

the_bishop8 wrote in antishurtugal, 2017-03-04 16:54:00

MOOD: irritated

Brisingr Spork, Part 16: To Answer a King


Hello everyone, welcome to the spork of To Answer a King.

So, Eragon gave a speech to the Varden last chapter, now Nasuada is ordering everyone back to their posts because they would be overwhelmed if an attack were to come. Paolini apparently realized that this would be a problem, but went with it anyway, not caring that it shows the Varden to be very undisciplined.

So Eragon and Co. go into Nasuada's tent. Saphira sticks her head in through a special flap in the back.

Purple flecks of light adorned the walls, projected by her blue scales onto the red fabric.

That's not how it works.

With only four pieces of furniture, the tent was austere even by military standards.

Saphira crushed Nasuada's furniture a few chapters ago, so now she only has her chair, a table filled with maps, her Skype mirror, and a folding chair. Which was the only stuff we ever knew was in her tent in the first place, so what did Saphira even crush? I asked Kris Norge what he thought about it, and figures that Nasuada should have her armor, a wardrobe, and a place to store the maps and documents on her table, so I'm just going to go ahead and assume that those are what Saphira crushed.

A bunch of nobles and unimportant named characters are in the tent for some a type of political social gathering.

For the next hour, Eragon endured what seemed like an endless procession of introductions, congratulations, and questions that he could not answer forthrightly without revealing secrets that were better left unsaid.

Did you answer those questions with “No comment”?

The people eventually all leave, but then Nasuada claps her hands and a second group comes in, and a third after that. I guess these groups are just waiting outside the tent for their turn?

Eragon is mostly frustrated by the whole thing, except he enjoys watching people's reactions to Nasuada's urgal guards. Some people ignore them, some glare at them, and some act with false bravado. The fact that he “enjoys” these reactions implies that he doesn't care about their concerns and worries. Maybe some of these people have personal reasons for hating or being scared of the urgals.

Another group doesn't mind the urgals at all; Nasuada, King Orrin, Trianna, and some random earl. I guess Arya minds them then?

Eventually, Saphira just growls to make them all leave. What was the point of that whole scene? Was it really important that we know that Eragon has to attend boring social gatherings?

“I am sorry that I had to subject you to the misery of public presentation, Eragon, but as I am sure you are aware, you occupy an exalted position among the Varden, and I cannot keep you to myself anymore. You belong to the people now. They demand that you recognize them and that you give them what they consider their rightful share of your time. Neither you nor Orrin nor I can refuse the wishes of the crowd. Even Galbatorix in his dark seat of power at Urû’baen fears the fickle crowd, although he may deny it to everyone, including himself.”

Nasuada thinks Galbatorix cares about the crowd, why? He's had two villages burned down by his own troops, and one of those villages didn't even do anything.

With the guests departed, King Orrin abandoned the guise of royal decorum. His stern expression relaxed into one of more human relief, irritation, and ferocious curiosity. Rolling his shoulders beneath his stiff robes, he looked at Nasuada and said, “I do not think we require your Nighthawks to wait on us any longer.”

Notice how Orrin relaxes here, this is important for later.

“Agreed.” Nasuada clapped her hands, dismissing the six guards from the inside of the tent.

Earlier when she clapped her hands, her guards took it as a signal to bring more nobles into the tent. So does she just clap her hands whenever she wants them to do something, and her guards automatically know what she wants?

“Now,” he said, switching his gaze between Eragon and Arya, “let us have a full account of your doings, Eragon Shadeslayer. I have heard only vague explanations for why you chose to delay at Helgrind, and I have had my fill of evasions and deceptive answers. I am determined to know the truth of the matter, so I warn you, do not attempt to conceal what actually transpired while you were in the Empire. Until I am satisfied you have told me everything there is to tell, none of us shall so much as step outside of this tent.”

So, Orrin isn't happy. He's been kept in the dark about things he has the right to know about.

How does Nasuada, master politician that she is, respond to him?

“You assume too much … Your Majesty. You do not have the authority to bind me in place; nor Eragon, who is my vassal; nor Saphira; nor Arya, who answers to no mortal lord but rather to one more powerful than the two of us combined. Nor do we have the authority to bind you. The five of us are as close to equals as any of us is likely to find in Alagaësia. You would do well to remember that.”

She gets pissed at the “threat” Orrin made at the end. Nasuada, that's just the type of thing people say when they want you to take them seriously.

Orrin apologizes for it anyway, and uses what Nasuada said about them being equals as an opening to explain how she doesn't treat him as an equal. He gives some examples, but they aren't the best examples to be honest.

“Eragon answers to you and only you. By the Trial of the Long Knives, you have gained dominion over the wandering tribes, many of which I have long counted among my subjects. And you command as you will both the Varden and the men of Surda, who have long served my family with bravery and determination beyond that of ordinary men.”

Eragon gave fealty to Nasuada on his own, the wandering tribes don't really treat Orrin as their king even if he lets them use his land or whatever, and Nasuada counters the last point on her own:

“It was you yourself who asked me to orchestrate this campaign,” said Nasuada. “I have not deposed you.”

“Aye, it was at my request you assumed command of our disparate forces. I am not ashamed to admit you have had more experience and success than I in waging war.”

More experience? The only battle she participated in before she took command of their combined forces was the Battle of Farthen Dur, and that wasn't even from a position of command!

Orrin then gives some better examples of how Nasuada has mistreated him, like how she had important meetings and made decisions without even bothering to inform him beforehand. He finishes by saying that if she doesn't get her act together, he'll start acting against her.

It looks like Paolini is trying to write a flaw in Nasuada's character; how she acts without thinking of the consequences to her allies. Which is a bit amazing considering that we're talking about Paolini here. We saw a little bit this earlier when her guards got mad at her for leaving them behind. Does it work? No, but we'll get to that in a bit.

So, what do Eragon and Saphira think about all of this? Saphira thinks Orrin is long-winded. Eragon is just worried about having to tell another person about Sloan. So basically, they don't give a damn.

The fewer people who know he’s alive, the better.

That's a good general guideline to keeping secrets, but their isn't a specific reason to keep Orrin in the dark. Maybe I would see Eragon's point of view better if I saw this as a secret actually worth keeping.

Saphira tells Eragon to listen to his heart. Great advice Saphira, you're really showing how useful you are here.

Now we see Nasuada respond to Orrin the way she should have in the first place: By being respectful and trying to appease him.

“If I have slighted you, Sire, then it was due to my own hasty carelessness and not to any desire on my part to diminish you or your house. Please forgive my lapses. They shall not happen again; that I promise you. As you have pointed out, I have but recently ascended to this post, and I have yet to master all of the accompanying niceties.”

This is why the flaw in Nasuada's character doesn't work: She doesn't keep this promise. She makes several important decisions later on without bothering to consult Orrin, the difference being that Orrin doesn't make an issue of it. As of this chapter, Nasuada has “learned” her lesson and the whole issue is resolved.

“As for Eragon and his activities in the Empire, I could not have provided you with specific details, for I have had no further intelligence myself. It was not, as I am sure you can appreciate, a situation that I wished to advertise.”

Why didn't you just tell Orrin that in the first place? He said he had been given vague explanations, evasions, and deceptive answers.

“Then let us tarry no longer,” said Nasuada. “Let us begin this beginning and have done with our suspense. Eragon, it is time for your tale.”

^This dialogue needs no sporking.

So, Eragon makes his decision and decides to tell Orrin about Sloan. Do we see his thought process and reasoning for choosing this? Nope.

With Nasuada and the others gazing at him with wondering eyes, Eragon made his choice.

This makes it sound like they are looking at Eragon in wonder, but I'm pretty sure Paolini was going for curiosity and interest.

Eragon asks them to keep this a secret, but doesn't have them swear it in the ancient language.

“It could cause a great deal of grief if this knowledge were to be whispered in the wrong ears.”

Grief for you, because then Roran would know that you had lied to his face?

So Eragon and Arya tell the story. Nasuada and Orrin think about it for a few minutes until Nasuada says she thinks Eragon did the right thing. Orrin agrees with her, which surprises everyone. Why does it surprise everyone? I don't know. Eragon says he didn't think Orrin would like Eragon's decision to spare Sloan, but I don't know why Eragon would think this, so it isn't really an explanation.

We've now arrived at the best part of the chapter; why Orrin approves of what happened to Sloan.

“Why do we approve? The rule of law must be upheld.”

For those who don't know, this is what the rule of law is according to Wikipedia:

The rule of law is the legal principle that law should govern a nation, as opposed to being governed by arbitrary decisions of individual government officials.

Arbitrary decisions of an individual government official pretty much describes Eragon and how he chose Sloan's punishment. The rule of law definitely wasn't upheld, so Orrin's statement doesn't make sense.

“If you had appointed yourself Sloan’s executioner, Eragon, you would have taken for yourself the power that Nasuada and I wield.”

Executioner? What about everything else Eragon did to Sloan?

“For he who has the audacity to determine who should live and who should die no longer serves the law but dictates the law.”

Okay, for some reason he's just talking about Eragon's decision to spare Sloan right now. When is he going to talk about everything else?

And for the record, Eragon's decision to spare Sloan didn't have to do with any of what Orrin is talking about. He even said he had the right of any king or queen at the time. Orrin's speech doesn't lead Eragon to any reflection about that statement.

“Do you understand, Eragon? You are so dangerous, we are forced to acknowledge the danger to your face and hope that you are one of the few people able to resist the lure of power.”

Eragon doesn't need to resist the lure of power. Power comes to him easily enough on its own.

“As inconvenient as this episode has been, it would have been far worse, and for you as well, if you had killed to please yourself and not in self-defense or in service to others.”

Torturing and exiling Sloan to please himself is just fine though.

Nasuada and Orrin then start asking a bunch of questions. When they're done Orrin and Arya leave.

So I guess everything else that happened to Sloan is going to be completely ignored? What the hell was Paolini thinking when he wrote this?

When she was alone with Eragon and Saphira, Nasuada sighed and leaned her head against the back of the chair. Eragon was shocked by how tired she appeared. Gone were her previous vitality and strength of presence. Gone was the fire from her eyes. She had, he realized, been pretending to be stronger than she was in order to avoid tempting her enemies and demoralizing the Varden with the spectacle of her weakness.

Earlier, Orrin relaxed when he was alone with Eragon, Saphira, Arya and Nasuada. Here, Nasuada only relaxes when Orrin and Arya are gone. This would seem to imply that she doesn't trust one or both of them, that she considers them her “enemies” as Eragon says, but nothing ever comes of this so it's just bad writing.

Nasuada is still weak from the Trial. They have some small talk.

“I have never aspired to rule; that is not my destiny.”

Yeah, you already have the right of any king or queen, so why bother taking the responsibilities of one?

They have more small talk, then Nasuada tells Eragon to wash up and invites him to her evening meal. Eragon accepts the invitation, and the chapter finally ends.

Two thing happened in this chapter. Orrin talks about how Nasuada doesn't treat him as an equal, and Orrin talks about Eragon's treatment of Sloan. The first is rendered irrelevant because Nasuada “learns” her lesson and then goes back to making important decisions on her own anyway. Then when they talk about Sloan, for some godforsaken reason they only talk about Eragon's decision to spare him. This chapter could have been important, but because of these mistakes it might as well have been cut.

Next up is torylltales with A Feast With Friends. Then I'll be back with Intersecting Sagas.

34 comments

[1]

minionnumber2
March 5 2017, 14:37:38
I've had nothing to add for like three chapters already. Jesus this book is boring and pointless.

[1A]

Anonymous
March 5 2017, 19:45:12
Yeah, lots of these could have been rolled together. A lot of times I mixed chapters up that were very similar. Between when Eragon returns and when he leaves for the Dwarves (and by the way the following chapters of life in the Varden are pretty much just a repeat of the ones before he leaves) are a blurry slog. Better would be to condense them into Hellgrind, Sloan, returning to the Varden, Nasuada's POV and then responsibilities and expectations in the Vaden. Five chapters. Each would be longer than the individual chapters they'd replace, while the total would be a lot shorter and sharper than the real final product.

- Anon 2

[1A1]

minionnumber2
March 6 2017, 08:10:06
If we could cut out the repeated conversations and some of the background stuff that doesn't actually effect anything it would also go by a lot smoother. We've had the exact same conversation about Sloan three times and nothing's really changed between the conversations beyond who's saying what.

[1A1A]

theepistler
March 6 2017, 16:25:37
Yeah, all we've had for a good while now has been endless repetitive recapping. Completely unnecessary recapping at that. It's not even written in a dramatic or interesting fashion; it's just flat dialogue, and the reactions Eragon gets from his listeners are equally flat and quite frankly dull. It really doesn't help that Paolini's dialogue has never been interesting to read. Some authors can make ordinary conversations between their characters fun to read, but Paolini is not one of them.

[2]

torylltales
March 5 2017, 15:34:18
Yay, my turn next! I'll be done with A Feast With Friends in a few days. I'm having a hard time keeping it to a decent word length.

For the next hour, Eragon endured what seemed like an endless procession of introductions, congratulations, and questions that he could not answer forthrightly without revealing secrets that were better left unsaid.

Did you answer those questions with “No comment”?

I laughed. :D

[3]

Anonymous
March 5 2017, 16:30:08
> Eventually, Saphira just growls to make them all leave. What was the point of that whole scene? Was it really important that we know that Eragon has to attend boring social gatherings?

Unfortunately I think so. The "plot" of this book is that Eragon and to a lesser extent Saphira have a lot of responsibilities to lots of people. This chapter was to show some of it.

Still, it doesn't mean it's interesting and because those nobles are no more than set dressing, what could be an important scene instead feels like yet another waste. Again we have potential that isn't met because at no point does is Eragon challenged to remember the names and deeds of nobles who might even patronage him.

I like the idea of what his book could have been. Showing the type of responsibilities and pressures of something is a realistic and interesting thing, if it's done properly. Brisingr didn't take it anywhere far enough.

- Anon 2

[3A]

minionnumber2
March 6 2017, 08:20:48
That's a good point. It would be kind of fun to see Eragon having to deal with actual politics and not just having people grovel at his feet and talk at him. Make a few compromises that he's not happy with but get him closer to his main goal, like having to support a guy he really doesn't like because the guy has resources and a cult of personality.

[4]

theepistler
March 5 2017, 16:52:48
One of my biggest questions about this chapter is why everyone is making such a big frigging deal about Sloan. Why the hell is he so important? If anything, Orrin and Nasuada should be pissed at Eragon for wasting time and risking his life over a complete nobody. He betrayed some podunk village in the middle of nowhere - nobody cares! Eragon SHOULD be told something on the lines of "just because it's important to you doesn't mean it's important to the rest of us and you have larger concerns and responsibilities you deliberately neglected for the sake of petty revenge on a man who was no threat to anybody, least of all the entire Varden."

But gods forbid Sparky McSpecial's even dumber brother ever be wrong about anything, let alone be pulled up for it.

And Nasuada is a complete snot to Orrin, who is easily her most important ally. Just how stupid is this girl? Pissing off and alienating the guy who provided the freaking backbone of your entire army is an incredibly bad idea, no matter how much you may personally dislike him. Orrin has every right to be angry, but she's treating him like a child. What an entitled bitch.

[4A]

torylltales
March 5 2017, 17:50:28
I feel kind of sorry for Orrin, if this were a historical account he's basically been character-assassinated. What happened to the intelligent, curious, competent, well-spoken and well-liked king we first met?

Granted, maybe the severe casualties among his people that resulted from the Varden's presence and stand-off in Eldest hardened and embittered him, but the character is so completely different that he may as well not be the same person.

[4A1]

theepistler
March 5 2017, 18:22:35
Yeah, me too. Add him to the list of characters Paolini completely assassinates in this book. It's up there with humble blacksmith Roran suddenly becoming a violent, arrogant jerk with military aspirations right the fuck out of nowhere.

Come to that, Eragon also does a complete 180 in this book, really. He's also become a hell of a lot more arrogant and entitled than he used to be, and more violent as well. I really can't see Book One's Eragon doing what this book's Eragon does to Sloan. What the hell happened? When did he get an ego the size of Alaska? He wasn't like this even in Eldest that I recall.

[4A1A]

torylltales
March 5 2017, 18:24:33
Maybe Eragon WAS replaced by an elf in book 2, having succumbed to the poison remaining in the scar given to him by Durza, and that's why Elf Eragon is so very different.

[4A1A1]

theepistler
March 5 2017, 18:43:41
That theory makes a disturbing amount of sense...

[4A1A1A]

torylltales
March 5 2017, 18:49:02
Someone was saying why don't the Varden and Carvahall villagers etc. seem at least the slightest bit wary of the man who came back from staying with the elves looking and acting completely differently, and why does nobody suspect him of having been replaced by an elf, and, well... who's to say he wasn't?

[4A1A1A1]

theepistler
March 5 2017, 18:54:08
Sporker Vivisector was the first person to suggest it, and I repeated the theory here because I think it's actually pretty plausible. And even if it's not true, that still doesn't explain why nobody has any suspicions, or indeed any problem with Eragon coming back from Ellesmera looking like a complete freak. And "a dragon spirit did it, and this has never happened before and no-one knows why" is one of the flimsiest excuses I ever heard. It sounds like something someone made up on the spur of the moment after being put on the spot by inconvenient questions.

[4A2]

doomotter
March 5 2017, 18:46:01
I actually liked Orrin when he first appeared, but I think whenever Pao Pao makes an interesting character he has to do something to ruin them. Hell his change from quirky intellectual to uptight jerk could have been an interesting piece of character development if handled right. He could have been described as finding war to be a lot more horrifying than the glorious histories claimed. I remember kids from my school going off to Iraq excited to be on some adventure. The ones who came back weren't so enthusiastic about life after that.

Add to that the fact that someone is constantly undermining his authority, and you have the beginnings of some great character development. Paolini however just wants to turn him into another asshole who doesn't like the protagonists and should be hated for it.

[5]

theepistler
March 5 2017, 16:54:05
And Eragon is considered to be on equal footing with a King even though he's some stupid farmboy who's accomplished very little of note. Uh-huh, that makes sense.

[5A]

torylltales
March 5 2017, 17:52:24
a stupid nobody farmboy with a fire-breathing, clawed and toothed dragon who is loyal only to him. I can kind of understand the leadership treating Eragon with a certain degree of deference in the name of keeping him happy and on their side.

[5A1]

theepistler
March 5 2017, 18:12:23 Edited: March 5 2017, 18:13:56
Yeah, except there's never any real indication that they're intimidated by him or Saphira (is anyone intimidated by Saphira? Honestly? Most of the NPCs just ignore her). Instead, Riders are Just That Special. And even so, Nasuada spends most of the Cycle ordering him around as if he's just another one of her underlings.

I find it really interesting that Eragon is Just That Special and Important... but is also never really in control of his life, instead being constantly at the beck and call of someone else. First it was Brom, then it was Ajihad, and now it's Nasuada. When he's finally given control of the situation, he freaks the fuck out and runs away to investigate some random prophecy thingy. And then he finds out he was being controlled by a bunch of dead dragons to begin with, so he's even less in control of his life than we thought. It's this really weird combination of him being super duper powerful, but also never really getting to make his own choices or live his own life according to his personal goals or desires.

Mind you, it would help if we even knew what his personal goals and desires even are. Near as I can tell he doesn't have any, since he has no life outside of serving the plot and fulfilling Paolini's personal fantasies. The poor bastard.

[5A1A]

kidwithrabbit
March 5 2017, 20:58:37
"is anyone intimidated by Saphira?"
Saphira can't be too intimidating. I can't remember exactly which book it was, but I distinctly remember a scene in the Varden camp where she was letting a bunch of kids climb all over her like a giant toy. It's an adorable mental image, really, but feels weird when characters keep claiming to be afraid that Galby or Murtaugh could pay them a visit at any time.

But yeah, other than that, she's largely ignored.

[5A1A1]

theepistler
March 5 2017, 21:01:59
Yeah, that happened during A Feast With Friends, a couple of chapters back. Saphira letting kids climb on her head doesn't strike me as very dragonish and proud. Most of the time she might as well be either Eragon's horse, or his pet cat. Or non-existent.

[5A1A1A]

torylltales
March 5 2017, 22:36:28
actually the next chapter after this one, I'll post the spork in a few days.

[5A1A1A1]

theepistler
March 6 2017, 07:39:02
Yeah, I realised just as I was drifting off to sleep that I'd gotten it wrong! (Typical). I got mixed up because we'd been talking about it via PM.

[5A1B]

Anonymous
March 6 2017, 04:28:48
I think it is another problem with the inmaturity of Paolini himself.
After all, it is much easier to let other people tell you what to do and providing you with orientation to make sure you never make a mistake. And if you do, it is not really your fault, because they gave you bad instructions.

(Yeah, the "I´m just following orders" mentality also aplies here. It is a bit creepy how much Paolini tries to avoid responsability for anything I guess)

[5A1B1]

theepistler
March 6 2017, 07:49:00
"But I was just doing what I was told!" is a pretty childish and irresponsible attitude, really. And it fits with Eragon's constant insistence on refusing to ever take responsibility for his actions, instead constantly fobbing off his mistakes and misdeeds on someone else. (Usually Galbatorix). Gods he's immature.

[5A1C]

minionnumber2
March 6 2017, 08:27:16
That's something that happens a lot with Chosen One stories, and I think why they appeal to teenagers so much.

"Hey, you're super special and awesome, here's a detail instruction list on how you're supposed to help us all and get all the credit for it."
"Thanks Morpheus! Actually working toward my goals would be hard work. It's a good thing there's a handy prophecy here to tell me exactly what to do next and to give me direction in my life."

[6]

zelaznamaska
March 6 2017, 01:56:53
It looks like Paolini is trying to write a flaw in Nasuada's character; how she acts without thinking of the consequences to her allies.

I read this scene as the continuation of the theme of "rivalling factions" - a sort of sequel to the Trial of the Long Knives, with Orrin being another petulant smooth-faced brat who won't let Nasuada, who is always right, to do her job in peace.
Her final answer to Orrin sounds so terribly false after the initial bickering.

And Orrin's speech makes no sense whatsoever. Although I think its purpose is not so much justifying Eragon's actions as presenting Orrin in a negative light: he's glad that Eragon didn't usurp the power by becoming Sloan's executioner (except he did, but let's disregard that for a moment) because as a petulant smooth-faced brat, he's afraid of Eragon becoming his rival, like Nasuada.

Nasuada relaxing in Eragon's company may be another reason for my E-N ship when I first read the book.

[6A]

theepistler
March 6 2017, 07:51:20
I think he wanted to portray Nasuada as proud, dignified and aloof or some junk like that. Every inch the Queen to be, harhar.

I think he also wanted to make it super obvious that Orrin wasn't "good enough" to be King of Alaglag despite being the only one with experience in governing plus the only one in this picture who isn't a fucking teenager.

[6A1]

Anonymous
March 6 2017, 14:28:57
Orrin actually ends up worse afterwards. Before, he ruled a sovereign state Galbatorix was content to ignore. After all the death and sacrifice and economic loss Surda put into the war, Nasuada bullies him into becoming her subject.

[6A1A]

theepistler
March 6 2017, 17:04:02 Edited: March 6 2017, 17:06:03
She really is a bit of a bully, isn't she? Certainly she's very entitled, just as much so as Eragon and Roran. She gets put in charge of a rebel faction and suddenly thinks she's the boss of everything.
Now I think about it, entitled behaviour is one thing all the viewpoint characters have in common, including Saphira. Not one of them is humble, or particularly grateful for anything they're given. It's pretty sad, really.

[6A1A1]

hidden_urchin
March 7 2017, 03:05:14
I think a lot of the entitlement comes from the characters having been given everything. How many of them actually had to work hard for their skills or positions? How many of them worked their butts off for something only to realize they would never reach their goal? How many of them failed with storychanging consequences?

[6A1A1A]

theepistler
March 7 2017, 07:48:02
Very true. If you treat your characters like spoiled brats, they'll probably start acting like it. Nas should never have been made leader of the Varden in the first place. They don't even need a single leader to begin with, let alone some dumbass teenager with zero military experience.

[6A1A1B]

Anonymous
March 7 2017, 22:41:18
Galbatorix out his traitors probably worked very hard for their positions.

[6A1A1B1]

Anonymous
March 7 2017, 22:43:10
*Galbatorix and his traitors

[6A1A1B1A]

theepistler
July 30 2017, 09:47:27
Indeed. But Paolini would never show us any of that, because it would be too hard to write, plus it wouldn't be about how awesome Eragon is, and we all know he can't abide that.